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although Hals's example has certainly the benefit of priority. He states, under the head of the parish of Egleshayle, that there was a Mr. Edward Hoblyn, a gent. and attorney-at-law, who was in possession of an estate in the parish called Crone or Croan, and that he was specially memorable for his saying, when he first began to practise, that he would get an estate by the law one way or other (which Hals, without proper authority, says means right or wrong); and as Hals proceeds to say


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Here lies Ned,

I am glad he's dead.

If there must be another,

I wish 'twere his brother,
And for the good of the nation
His whole relation." "

Under the head of Falmouth, Hals mentions Thomas Killigrew, of the Arwinick family, a celebrated wit and Master of the Revels in the time of Charles II., but not a regularly installed jester. He went to Paris in the time of Louis XIV.; but, being politically out of humour, was silent, and the great monarch thought him dull. He showed him his fine collection of pictures, of which Killigrew took little notice, and appeared to know nothing about them. At last the king showed him a picture of the Crucifixion, which was placed between two portraits, but still the wit said he did not know what it meant.

“Why then," said the king, "I will tell you what they are: the picture in the centre is the draught of our Saviour on the cross; that on the right-hand of him is the pope's picture, and that on the left is my own."

"I humbly thank your majesty," says Killigrew, "for the information you have given me; for though I have often heard that our Saviour was crucified between two thieves, yet I never knew who they were till now."

The king was now convinced of Killigrew's power of wit and satire, for at this time he and the pope were cruelly persecuting the French Protestants, and dragooning them to mass driving them out of the kingdom.



THE PRICE OF CONSOLS.-The following, taken from Morgan's British Trade Journal of July 2, is worth preserving:

"Consols * are now at the highest point they have reached since 1860. They were at 100 ex-dividend in 1852, while the rate of discount was 2 per cent. The highest price touched by consols during the present century was 101, on the 24th Dec. 1852; eight years previously-namely, on the 20th Dec. 1844, transactions

* "Consols for money and the account yesterday were last quoted heavy at 944 and 94 respectively."-Standard, July 4, 1867.

took place at 1013, but this included the accrued dividend of 1 per cent. The lowest price of the century was 50, in July, 1803, on the recommencement of hostilities beprevious century was 113, in the year 1736; and the tween England and France. The highest point of the lowest, in 1798, was 47. During the past twenty years, the average price of consols has been 92." X. C.

A LADY'S WARDROBE IN 1622.-The following deserves a place in "N. & Q." :

"Note of Lady Elizabeth Morgan, late Sister to Sir Nathaniel Rich, her wearing apparell beinge in a great bar'd Chest in my Ladie's Bedchamber, this 13th day of Novr, 1622.

"Imprimis. 1 grene damask gowne, kirtell, and wastcoate with gould and silver lace.

1 tamy gould satten gowne and kirtell, and wastcoate laid with gould lace.

1 black silke grograme gowne, kirtell and wastcoate striped with silver.

1 blacke satten gowne, kirtell, and wastcoate set with goulde buttons.

1 willow colored satten peticoate imbrothered."

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May I be allowed also to notice, what is no doubt a printer's error, that in the succeeding Leonard da Vinci, late in the possession of Mr. essay, in alluding to a celebrated painting by Troward of Pall Mall, he says:


"He who could paint that wonderful personification of the Logos, or third person of the Trinity, grasping a globe when the hand was, by the boldest license, twice as big as the truth of drawing warranted: yet the effect, to every one who saw it, was confessed by some magic of

genius, not to be monstrous, but miraculous and silencing."

As there is no list of errata (indeed, with this exception, there requires none) I mention it for future correction, never having heard the third person of the Trinity called Logos. J. A. G.

BISHOP BUTLER'S BEST BOOK. Mr. Froude, in his Short Studies on Great Subjects (i. 34), says that Bishop Butler

"Says somewhere, that the best book which could be written would be a book consisting only of premises, from which the readers should draw conclusions for themselves."

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May Fair.

C. A. W.

Doctors' dicta bristle in array on either side of to lay down drawing paper for water-colour every human question of right and wrong. drawings on another paper? Common paste can be worked more smoothly, and stands the subsequent wetting better than anything I have yet tried; but after the paper has been put aside for a time, the paste is apt to cause spots, which are not visible until the washes of colour are laid on and cannot be remedied.

DRINKING-CUP INSCRIPTION. -The following inscription for a drinking-cup occurs in a most unlikely place. In The Compleat Clark, containing the best forms of all Sorts of Presidents, 1664, p. 850, is a form for "a citizen's will." In this document an imaginary J. G. is made to say —

"I give to the worshipful company of M. in L. whereof I am a fellow, towards a recreation to be had amongst them at my burial, the sum of 67. 13s. 4d., and a cup of silver and gilt, of the weight of 40 ounces, to remain in that company for ever, and to have graven in the bottom these two letters J. G., and a posie written in this manner "When the Drink is out, and the bottom you may see, Remember your brother J. G.

as a remembrance of my Fellowship amongst them. Also I will that there be spice-bread given to the Livery according to the custom.'



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CONSECRATION OF A CHURCH BY AN ARCHDEACON.-It is stated in Newcourt's Repertorium (vol. ii. p. 84) that the church of WoodhamWalter, in Essex, being fallen very much into decay, and standing at a great distance from the village, licence was granted to Thomas Earl of Sussex, in 1562, to build a new church there on such site as he should think fit; which the earl did, and the new church was consecrated April 30, 1562,"by Thomas Cole, Archdeacon of Essex, es

pecially commissionated thereto by Edward Grindall, Bishop of London."

Is this instance unique, or is it competent to an archdeacon to consecrate a church?

JUXTA-TURRIM. DRAWINGS.-Can any of your readers tell me of a paste or glue which can be used with safety


A. F. B.

"The Pedlingtonians proclaimed Daubson for their own, and were proud to be Pedlingtonians; the Highlander, where grass will not grow, and the sunshine is about as frequent as an eclipse, says, 'This is my own, my native land;' and Laclerque describes a Dutch tragedy, in which a Spaniard says to the hero, 'You speak like a warrior,' and is answered, Yes! I speak like a Dutchman,' on which the Spaniard exclaims Would I were one!"""On National Pride," in Collectanea, by James E. Brenton. Philadelphia, 1834, 12mo, p. 76.

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R. I.

"FORM."- Within the last year or two this word has been used in the sporting department of our newspapers in a sense that has altogether puzzled me. The form of a racehorse used to mean his shape; but now the term is employed in a manner altogether new; and I turn to "N. & Q." to enlighten my ignorance. So long as I read of "form only in the sporting portion when a word has been used by The Times in an I was content to pass it by, but my newspaper editorial article, it acquires a certain degree of authority. In March of last year, when commenting on the University boat-race, The Times thus spoke of the Oxonians:-" The victors, whose form was far from faultless, but whose courage was invincible." And to-day (July 2), in looking over the new volume of the Annual Register, I find "form" embalmed in the grave pages of that standard work. In describing the University boat-race, the Annual Register mentions "form no less than seven times, and in their reports of the various races of the year this pet word again occurs. Will some sporting reader of "N. & Q." kindly explain the sense in which it is used the new meaning attached to this old word? JAYDEE.

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Titeyrre): Les seigneurs de ce nom descendent d'une des plus anciennes maisons de Normandie, qui sous le règne de Guillaume le Conquérant passèrent avec lui en Angleterre. . . . . Les Titaires eurent beaucoup de Seigneuries, Fiefs on Manoirs dans les Comtés de Fling, de Daubigh, et dans la Principauté de Galles.', La branche anglaise fut représentée en 1730 par Édouard, Lord Titeyre, Comte de Goring, qui de son mariage avec Josephine Elizabeth Moyra, fille unique de Lord Moyra, Comte de Cambell, avait deux fils et trois filles !"

Can any of your readers throw any light on the above-mentioned personages, or the above-quoted author (whose name does not appear in Lowndes), or must we conclude that the French surpass even ourselves in their ingenuity in pedigreemaking? F. D. H. LARGE PAPER COPIES.-Wishing to know when first the custom began of printing certain copies of books on large paper as specialities, and having no books on the subject to refer to where I am, I venture to ask your readers if they would kindly assist by giving any information upon the matter through that valuable "medium of intercommunication for literary men," "N. & Q." ?

Poets' Corner.

A. A.

NAUTICAL SAYING.- What is the origin, if known, and correct wording of the sailor's comment on an improbable story: "Tell that to the marines, for the sailors won't believe it"? A friend insists that it should be "horse marines."


PENNY.-Is the Sanscrit word panna, a copper value, or coin (?) in the laws of Menu, the origin of our word penny? CALCUTTENSIS.

GEORGES PILLESARY.-Where can I find some account of M. Georges Pillesary, General of Marine under Louis XIV.? His daughter Angélique was the second wife of the first Viscount St. John. French memoirs of his time do not mention him. LYDIARD.

OLD SEALS ON CHARTERS, ETC.-Will any correspondent inform me what constitutes the substances of seals which are attached to old charters,


S. M. P.

ST. CATALDUS AND ST. PETER. -This saint is said to have been the first Bishop of Taranto in the south of Italy, and by tradition a native of Raphoe in Ireland. Can any of your correspondents acquainted with the saints of the Roman Calendar give his Irish name, and state at what period he lived? The Tarantines claim to have received their first knowledge of Christianity from St. Peter, who landed, as they say, at a spot about twenty miles south of Taranto, on the shore of the bay, where a chapel sacred to the Apostle comme

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[For some account of St. Cataldus consult Alban Butler's Lives of the Saints, May 10; and Ware's Ireland, by Harris, i. 549,-ED.]

morates the event. They maintain that the first mass performed in Italy was in one of the churches of their town. Perhaps some one acquainted with ecclesiastical history can give authority for this statement respecting St. Peter. C. T. RAMAGE.

SUNK CHURCH.-There is on the hill side below Sawcliffe, in North Lincolnshire, a huge mass of travertine, of serpentine form, about forty yards long, and rising above the surface seven or eight feet in some parts of it, the water from which it was deposited being now carried down by an underdrain. It has been called, time out of memory, "sunk church " or "sunken church."

According to a note in Wordsworth's Sonnets on the Duddon, there is a "Druidical circle about half a mile to the left of the road ascending Stoneside from the vale of Duddon; the country people call it 'sunken church."" Can I be informed of other antiquities, natural or artificial, bearing this appellation?


J. F.

THE THREE PIGEONS.-Will some one learned in the symbolism of signboards explain the meaning of this sign, which seems to have been a common one, and possibly possessed a religious significance? The Salutation Sign, Annunciation, and Three Kings of Cologne, suggest some such meaning. Goldsmith's famous song has made the "Three Jolly Pigeons" familiar. It was a sign in the west of Ireland more than a century ago; and I find it also in France at as early a period. I quote from Jay's Dictionnaire des Contemporains, 1825, under the head "Revaiol".

"Son père. acheta à Bagnols . . une auberge,

les trois pigeons," &c. &c.

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N. B. C.

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WALTHAM ABBEY.-Can any of your correspondents inform me when the existing outside arch of Waltham Abbey was erected-that is, the arch which formerly divided the nave from the chancel, and is now built up to form the end of the present church? C.

CARDINAL WOLSEY'S BEDSTEAD.-Twenty years ago I was shown at an old farm-house (I think the Manor Farm) at Ingarsby, Leicestershire, an ancient bedstead, stated by the good people of the house to have been brought from the Abbey at Leicester, and to have been that on which the great cardinal died. Can this statement be corroborated? I well remember that the bedstead I saw was of elaborately carved oak, in good preservation, and evidently of some antiquity. C.


Queries with Answers.

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STYLE OF "REVEREND" AND "VERY REVEREND." Dr. South, in his Animadversions upon Dr. Sherlock's Book, entituled "A Vindication of the Trinity," &c., says of Sherlock's friends (p. ii.) :"Nay, and some I find creeping under his feet, with the title of Very Reverend, while they are charging him with such qualities and humours as none can be justly chargeable with and deserve reverence too. For my own part, I frankly own that I neither reverence nor fear him."

These Animadversions were published in 1693. Now, it could hardly have been reckoned, even by so uncompromising a controversialist as South, an act of sycophancy to give Sherlock his style of "Very Reverend," if that had been a mere matter of course: so that I should be glad to learn, through the medium of "N. & Q.," how long it has been the practice in England to address a Dean as "Very Reverend." And this suggests to me to ask further, since what period it has been usual to address a clergyman as "the Rev. Mr. B.," or "the Rev. A. B." In a list of annual preachers at a school-anniversary, which I saw some years ago, the style "Rev." was first used (if my memory serves me right) early in the last century. At Cambridge, to this day, a preacher before the University (if a simple M.A.) is described in the notice posted in the colleges as "Mr. A. B. of Christ College." S. C.

[Respecting Deans being styled "Very Reverend," the late John Wilson Croker stated in "N. & Q." (1* S. iii. 437) that, in a long series of old almanacks in his library, the list of Deans is invariably given as the "Reverend the Dean" down to the year 1803. The three following years were wanting; but in that of 1807, the Dean is styled

the "Very Reverend." From the passage quoted by S. C. it would seem that this honorary attribute was in use more than a century earlier.

The title of Reverend was given to the judges as late as the seventeenth century. Hence we read, “And as the Rev. Sir Edward Coke, late Lord Chief-Justice of His Majesty's Bench, saith," &c. By some, this title is supposed to have been retained by them from the time when ecclesiastics filled the judicial offices; whilst others consider that it was merely a title of respect applied to all persons to whom, on account of their position in society, great deference was due. In the seventeenth century the word Reverend was usually coupled with learned, e. "That Reverend and learned Dr. Jackson." Bishop Patrick quotes "the Reverend and learned Dr.

Hammond." Beneath the portrait of John Kettlewell we read "The true effigy of the Reverend and learned Mr. John Kettlewell," &c. Vide "N. & Q.," 1st S. vi. 246.]

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faces which most people are familiar with. On one side it is a pope's head with tiara, which, when turned upside down, represents the devil, with a long curling horn (the faces are naturally in profile) and big ears. Inscription: ECCLESIA On the other side is a cardinal's head; and this, on being turned upside down, presents a fool's head, cap, and bells. The inscription is, STVLTI. ALIQUANDO [here, I think, there is a short word obliterated] SAPIENTES. There appears to be no date. Can any reader of "N. & Q." tell me anything about this medal? The heads are very clear; the inscriptions not so much so. R. C. S. W.



[The medal described by our correspondent is figured Rigollot's Monnaies des Fous (plate 4, fig. 10), and is correctly described by him (p. xc.) as a satirical medal directed against the court of Rome. The inscriptions are correctly given by our correspondent. Leber describes

and gives a figure of a similar medal directed against Calvin on one side of which is a double head of Calvin mitred and a horned devil, and the inscription, JOAN. CALVINUS HERESIARCH PESSIMUS; and on the reverse the double head of a cardinal and a fool, and the inscription, ET STULTI, ALIQUANDO SAPITE, PSAL. XCIII. See "N. & Q.," 1st S. vii. 238.]

SIR JOHN HADLEY.-Can you inform me if there is in London a monument or gravestone to Sir John Hadley, Lord Mayor of London about the year 1463 [?]. Also any information regarding the family as to their ancestry and arms will much oblige. One branch of the family, I believe, settled in Warwickshire.

Hadley, Hereford.


[Sir John Hadley, sheriff in 1375, was twice Mayor of London, 1379 and 1393. He was buried in the church of

St. Pancras, Soper Lane, where was his monument. There were many old monuments in this church of opulent citizens, ranging from 1360 to 1536; but the fanatical rage which prevailed after the Reformation caused nearly all of them to be demolished. At the great fire of London the church itself was destroyed. Sir John Hadley's arms are: Az. a chevron between three annulets or, over all, on a fesse of the second, as many martlets gules.]

BERKELEY.-I shall be greatly obliged to anyone who will tell me the author, original place, and right reading of the line

"And coxcombs vanquish Berkeley with a grin." Lewes to Pope; but I cannot find it in his It is ascribed by Mr. J. S. Mill and Mr. G. H. writings. The line has been recently quoted, without a reference, as —

"Fops refuted Berkeley with a sneer."

W. T. C. [This line is taken from Dr. Brown's Essay on Satire, part ii. ver. 224. The entire couplet is —

"Truth's sacred fort th' exploded laugh shall win, And coxcombs vanquish Berkeley by a grin."

Dr. Brown's Essay is prefixed to Pope's Essay on Man, in Warburton's edition of Pope's Works, vol. iii. p. 15, edit. 1770, 8vo.]



"Pereant qui ante nos nostra dixerint." The author of this anathema was long ago inquired for in "N. & Q." In 1st S. xii. 35, a respondent (W. M. T.), quoting from the "Biglow Papers," gives it to St. Augustine. I have just found, in another American author (O. W. Holmes, The Autocrat of the Breakfast Table, p. 129), a different source assigned to it. He cites-"that familiar line from Donatus:

'Pereant illi qui ante nos nostra dixerunt." " Donatus the schismatic, or Donatus the grammarian? And which is right, Lowell or Holmes? H. K.

5, Paper Buildings, Temple.

[Warton, in his Essay on Pope, in a note, i. 88 (ed. 1806), shows that it was Donatus the grammarian: "St. Jerome relates that his preceptor Donatus, explaining that sensible passage in Terence

'Nihil est dictum quod non sit dictum prius,'railed severely at the ancients for taking from him his best thoughts:

'Pereant qui ante nos, nostra dixerunt.'"]

ASTRAKHAN. — Where can I find a practical account of the manufacture of isinglass as carried on in Astrakhan? Information addressed to CIVIS, care of Mr. Packer, 23, King Street, Portman Square, London, will oblige.

[The account given by Martius of the preparation of Russian isinglass is as follows:-The swimming bladders of the fish are first placed in hot water, carefully deprived of adhering blood, cut open longitudinally, and exposed to the air, with the inner delicate silvery membrane upwards. When dried, this fine membrane is removed by beating and rubbing, and the swimming bladder is then made into different forms. Consult Tomlinson's Cyclopadia of Useful Arts, &c., ed. 1852, i. 754; the Encyclopadia Britannica, ed. 1856, xii. 628; and the English Cyclopædia, "Arts and Sciences," iv. 998.]

SHAKESPEARE.-Could you tell me who is the author of the following two books?

1. “Shakespeare and his Friends; or the Golden Age

of Merry England."

2. " The Youth of Shakespeare."

Both works were published in 3 vols. by Henry Colburn; the former in 1838, the latter in 1839. P. O. W. [Both works are by Robert Folkestone Williams, author of The Domestic Manners of the Royal Family, &c.]

COLLECTION OF BULLS.-Where could I meet with a collection of all the bulls issued by the

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The story of the murder of Sir James Stansfield at Newmilns, near Haddington, in 1687, is one of grim interest. vol. ii.; Lord Fountainhall's Works, &c.) It is (See State Trials, by Howell, remarkable that it has hitherto escaped the sensation novelists. Certainly, imagination could not invent a more dreadful story. The poor knight complaining with sighs and tears to his friend, in the Edinburgh Coffee-house, that he had no comfort in wife or sons, his dreary ride home to Newmilns that bleak November evening, - the sounds of horror in the house during the night, causing his guest, pious Mr. Bell, to betake himself to his prayers, thinking the house was in possession of evil spirits, the discovery of the indecent interment, and the suspicions and rubody floating amidst the ice, the hurried and the scene in Morhame church, when the son asmours consequent on it, the disinterment and sists to raise his father's body, and the gush of blood flows over his parricidal hands, his horrorstruck exclamation, "Lord, have mercy upon me!"-the trial, conviction, and execution, with the extraordinary mishap of the slip of the rope, the parricide falling on his knees on the scaffold, and being ultimately strangled by the executioner, dying thus the very death he had inflicted on his own father, and the horrible rumours afloat respecting Lady Stansfield; all combine to form a picture of horrors never surpassed by the most unhealthy imagination of the Eugene Sue stamp.

The "testament dative and inventar of the gudes and gear" of the ill-fated Sir James is preserved in the Register of Confirmed Testaments, General Register House, Edinburgh.

Commissariat of Edinburgh, vol. lxxix.) It was given in to the Commissaries of Edinburgh in 1688 by William Smyth, merchant in Edinburgh, as assignee, his brother Alexander, also a merchant in Edinburgh, becoming "cautioner." It appears from it, amongst other particulars, that Sir James had incurred debts by bond to one James Todrig and Margaret Syme his wife, whose daughter, Jean, William Smyth had married; and from the "trial" it appears that Sir James had a brother-in-law, Mr. Patrick Smyth, advocate.

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